Keeping It 101: A Killjoy's Introduction to Religion Podcast

Review Session: What Did We Learn? Where Do We Go From Here?

• Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst and Megan Goodwin • Season 2 • Episode 208

Share episode

In which we review this season's big take-away lessons, reflect on what's working and how we can improve, and get our collective Grinch on.

Homework: have fun!

As always, be sure to visit keepingit101.com for full show notes, homework, transcripts, & more!

____
Keeping It 101: A Killjoy's Introduction to Religion is proud to be part of the Amplify Podcast Network.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

This is Keeping it 101, a killjoy's introduction to religion podcast. This season our work is made possible in part through a generous grant from the New England Humanities Consortium. And with additional support from the University of Vermont's Humanities Center. We are grateful to live, teach, and record on the ancestral and unseeded lands of the Abenaki, Wabenaki and Aucoisco peoples.

Megan Goodwin:

What's up, nerds? Hi, hello, I'm Megan Goodwin, a scholar of American religions, race. and gender. I'm totally buggin' that it's the last episode of the season!

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Hi, hello, I'm Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst, a scholar of religion, Islam, race and racialization, and history. It's way harsh, having to wrap all this up.

Megan Goodwin:

Way harsh, Tai. Hey, nerds. Can you believe we're at the end of season two? Truly a Twin Peaks experience. Who would have thunk this podcast, which may have started as a Monet but it's decidedly a Baldwin, would do all this kill-joying and still have y'all listening?

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

I mean, we hoped so. It's- it's us.

Megan Goodwin:

Right.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

We did. Way to hang in there, nerds. We knew you could do it.

Megan Goodwin:

Last day of class check in friend. We'll- we'll talk more about teaching with the pod later, but just- just in general, how you feeling?

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

I mean, I'm feeling pretty full. We're recording just after Thanksgiving and just ahead of my own birthday. And before the dreaded holiday season. Um, so I guess I'm pretty- I'm feeling pretty full. I'm pretty full up.

Megan Goodwin:

Yup, yup.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

So, how are you doin'?

Megan Goodwin:

I mean, I- I likewise, had the- the ritual sacrifice to colonial- settler colonialism yesterday. So I am tired because turkey and also tired because this semester feels like it's been 8 million years long. Yeah.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Yeah, no. We've aged 40 years this month.

Megan Goodwin:

Easily, easily 40 years, to say nothing of the 50 years we aged last month. So yeah. Tired.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

I'm perturbatively 809 years old this weekend.

Megan Goodwin:

Just this weekend.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Yeah.

Megan Goodwin:

You'll be a full on millennium by next weekend. Great, good.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Call me Methuselah.

Megan Goodwin:

Nice. All right, Irishing back up now. We're recording this, uh, just after Thanksgiving, as we said, and in the spirit of the season, we will be showing up at your homes, eating your food, stealing your houses and telling you you're wrong about religion. No, JK, only that last part is true. But in this time of quarantine and finals, we encourage you to veg out with us and reflect on what we learned this season. No party clothes required. They're so binding.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Let's get rolling, homies. It's time for the LESSON PLAN. A lesson plan, as IF.

Megan Goodwin:

With the homies! Rest in peace Britney, we miss you. Today we're gonna talk about what we've learned in this season. We'll also reflect on being killjoys, and on using public humanities scholarship as both research and teaching. Plus, we'll give you a teaser for next season. It's gonna be a blast.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

So today's lesson plan, then. We're gonna review our main takeaways for thinking about religion, race, gender, and sexuality. Talk about teaching, and offer a self assessment and spoil the heck out of next season.

Megan Goodwin:

Excellent. Our thesis for season two was pretty simple. Uh, I'm sure you remember, but, short version, you can't understand religion if you're not also thinking about race, gender, and sexuality. Intersectionality, bitches. And as we showed you a lot, we built our understandings of race, gender, and sexuality out of religion, not just religion, but not not religion. Even when the connections between religion, race, gender, and sexuality aren't immediately clear.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Yes! Yes. And we want to chat us through not just what we've already laid out, but why and how we did it. Because transparent pedagogy is praxis, y'all. So let's talk about learning objectives. Think of this as a little self assessment episode with the added bonus of talking directly to our colleagues who teach with this podcast. And like, there's a lot of y'all so thanks for that, by the way.

Megan Goodwin:

Yeah, thanks. We appreciate you. Keeping it 101

ON TODAY:

the segment where we do some professor work.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Alright, Goodwin, you want to- you want to do our little review? What do you think our major takeaway- take-homes for the season were?

Megan Goodwin:

Okay, uh, social constructs. We made them up, but also they do real work in the world. So just because we made them up doesn't mean that they're fake or not important. And when we're talking about social constructs, we're talking about important ways we structure our cultures and our world. Things like race and gender and sexuality and, you know, religion, we made them up, but they still have real world effects. When we're thinking about social constructs like race and gender and sexuality, we're thinking about the way that they structure and work on and- and do violence to our bodies and do violence about our bodies, our own bodies, and the bodies of others.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Yeah.

Megan Goodwin: Intersectionality:

being the overlapping way experiences of privilege and oppression inform the way that we are in the world. And if we are not aware of the fact that you can't separate your race, from your gender, from your sexuality, from your ability, from all of the other things that make you up, you are just fundamentally misunderstanding the human experience. So, intersectionality, not a cute day on your syllabus, is, in fact, the way that we get at everything else.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Yes!(Exclamation point)

Megan Goodwin:

Exclamation point. And in the season of giving thanks, we give thanks to scholars who went before us like Kimberl Crenshaw and Patricia Hill Collins, who helped us think more carefully and deliberately about intersectionality. Race, gender, and sexuality also not optional for analysis, cuz it turns out all people have them. So we're not just talking about race when we're talking about not-white people. We're not just talking about gender. So- I'm never getting over "people of gender." Not just women, not just nonbinary, like, everybody has gender, everybody has sexuality, even if your sexuality is no thank you please. Religion shapes our understandings of race, gender, and sexuality, which is why we have been talking about it all season. And just to sum up, the TLDR is no one, no one, can think about religion without thinking race, gender, and sexuality. And it's not just that you're not allowed. It's not like I'm a grumpy feminist, and how fucking dare you. Truly, you're not fully understanding religion, if you're not paying attention to the material experiences, and ways of knowing that make up the people who do the religion. So that- that was- that was so much, I must give ourselves- It was too much, truly. But we're gonna keep talking about it forever, so don't worry about it. I also must give ourselves snaps for all the good work we have been doing. But I also feel like we've barely scratched the surface.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Yeah, I mean, this is just a season. These are, you know, 35 to 50 minute podcast episodes. Of course, there is still so so much work. We can, and guess what nerds, we totally will, expand on each and every single one of these major take-home themes. As this pod continues, we plan to do exactly that. But for now, hold tight to your butts. Never let them go, because, we got to do some meta professor work.

Megan Goodwin:

That's right friends, we're gonna analyze our analysis. Let's talk about what we learned by hopefully helping you learn in a new segment I'd like to call TEACHER'S LOUNGE.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

What's the theme song? Okay. Anyway, uh, professor work includes thinking critically about our research and teaching, just like we think critically about the work of others. So in this Teacher's Lounge, let's turn the analysis on us. Megan, I can start, or you can start. But let's do a wee lil self-assessment.

Megan Goodwin:

Alright, settle down Beavis. I love a self-assessment, in large part because I have pretty good self esteem, and I'm surrounded by a lot of positive support. So-

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

You're welcome!

Megan Goodwin:

These are good or me, yeah. I appreciate you. But why are we doing this? Do w just not want the season to end"Love you like a sister,

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

"Have a good summer!" But also, if this podcast is scholarship, which is what we're claiming, right? Like we are- we are supported by, at this point, a grant, specifically because what we're doing is scholarship in public. So if this scholarship, sorry- if this podcast is scholarship, even though, dear nerds, it does not have a double blind peer review... Yet. And, if we're thinking about

Megan Goodwin:

Yet. this podcast as scholarship and we want to think about the modes of assessment that folks like Hannah McGregor are using over at Secret Feminist Agenda is just one example, then the truth is that we have to do some self-assessment. We, like, just a little? Let's- let's- let's humor me, let's bring in some scholarly practices to humor the- the REAL nerd of the- of the- two of us. Fine, fine. I guess we don't want to be virgins who can't drive. Even though virginity is also a misogynist social construct, and taking the bus or the train is better for the environment, anyway, so there. Let's assess, but you go first,

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Fine. Alright. One of the things I think that's working for us here at Keeping it 101 is the basics, actually. We are, you know, dust your shoulders off, really good at stating the issues clearly. We do a lot of theory work, but we explain it in understandable ways and with loads of historical support. We have accessible and built upon show notes like- we're making bibliographies and glossaries, and lists and explanations both"on air," right now as we ch t with you, but also in o r webpages so that they're stat c and searchable and you c n return to them easily. Religi n is so misunderstood, and race s so misunderstood, and gender s so misunderstood, that I thi k what we do this season and wh t we do broadly is a good job f juggling all those intellectu l balls while still talking, li e people, not eggheads (most f the time

Megan Goodwin:

Mostly. Yeah. Okay, a thing I have been thinking a lot about is impact. Public scholarship is a- is a big part of my job. And I tell folks all the time that good public scholarship is good pedagogy. But it's one thing to like, know that or to plan an op-ed around one central message like you would a single class discussion. It's another thing entirely to be, so real, having like- I have been yelling about cults on the internet for literal years. And it just- it made- honestly it felt like I made very little headway at all. And then we did the Cults episode because again, Judith Weisenfeld asked us to the cults episode because she is very wise. And then so many folks came back and said that it made them radically rethink both the word and the concept and how they teach it and they stopped using that word and- I just. You, Ilyse, suggested that I might be more effective when I use my teacher voice than when I use my "someone on the internet is wrong!" voice, and while it is fun to yell, you're probably right, as you so often are, annoyingly, that teaching voice works better. Like the more you know.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Okay- I'll pull it to- I'll pull it together!

Megan Goodwin:

No it's fine- you get a smug chuckle.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

It's not even a smug chuckle it's really like I- I feel like it is shocking that you did not realize that, but like-

Megan Goodwin:

Fine. But I'm right? Why do I have to be right AND, like, accessible Goddamn it? turns out, right is not enough. Fuck. Oh, well. Um, I would also like to offer my love and respect to the end for past-us deciding to launch this pod two months before a damn pandemic.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Oh, yeah. Holy crap.

Megan Goodwin:

Because- who knew! It's not just that the pod meant we did a lot of lessons ahead of a truly cuckoo banana-pants time to be teaching, though I'm definitely not mad that we worked ahead, take that grade school teachers who kept demanding I, "pay attention" or whatever. I was so grateful to have non-written and(I hope anyway), fun sources t assign in my world religion class. It's always weir assigning your own work, but th students seem to dig the pod an I definitely used the show not s when I was tweaking my sylla i. You- you, specifically in luded some rad stuff that I ei her forgot about or just mi sed the first time. So thanks fo that lady.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

You're welcome. Yeah, and I'll say my very own students are using the pod tooo, also in my scramble to make accessible, non-reading assignments in this pandemic uni- remote-teaching universe. And I know that some of the- some other UVM students of my Dream Team colleagues- so hi to Vicki and Tom- are also using- they're also using

Megan Goodwin:

Hi Vicki, hi Tom! the podcast. And what's interesting is that since you and I have made this little space to be ourselves with each other. I feel like what I've lost in face to face instruction, this, frankly, whole year, has been at least partially made up with this pod. So the improved bits, the like- the improv'd bits of a classroom lecture don't translate as well on a recorded PowerPoint or a Flip Grid or whatever tech I'm using this week. But through the pod, and with you to bounce of of, I feel like we've got a goo little thing going that feel somewhat more normal an engaging and interesting for, n t just our students, but t e frankly the- all those stude ts that are listeni Yeah, yeah. Yeah, it's- it's been cool. I've done a couple, like, virtual class visits this semester. And some of them, I guess, they've been listening to the pod for class. It's like, wait, I know this voice! It's- it's cool. And I'm like- I really- I am- I am, humbled, truly. And that- that takes a lot. That so many of you- it does, it takes some work, that's an uphill battle. But so many of you all, like, assigned this in your classes, and with that pooled on the resources that we pulled together, and that's just- yeah, it makes this whole semester feel a little bit less isolated and a little bit less devoid of joy. So...

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Yeah, so it sounds like we think we're teaching in an accessible way. We're making plain some of the highfalutin theory work that you and I both love and detest and love again. That's- um.

Megan Goodwin:

Be-because theory without concrete support, it's nonsense talk.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Yes. But also, we're doing both of those things at the same time.

Megan Goodwin:

Yeah.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

So it sounds like we think we're doing a great job, but! Assessment isn't really assessment without critique, lady. So I'mma flip.

Megan Goodwin:

Fair, fair.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Um, I'll go first, I think the thing that we actually can improve upon is that, in the interest of time, our and I guess I mean, my shock and awe style pedagogy can raise more questions in this format than- than we can actually answer. And I think, listening back, there are episodes that, to me, feel a little bit rushed. Like, we know what we want to say, but we're plowing through and we're trying so hard to tell everyone, everything that we move a little bit too quickly.

Megan Goodwin:

Yeah, yeah, yes. Yes, to that. I think a lot about friend of the pod Gene Gallagher's great pedagogy article called "Teaching For Religious Literacy," where he encourages teachers, especially of intro courses, to and I'm gonna quote here, "intentionally and gratefully abandon the quixotic hope of coverage"(2009, 219). I think about that line all the time. And yet, I always struggle with trying to cover as much as I possibly can. So yeah, moving forward, maybe we can try to like I dunno- slo- slow down a little while continuing our commitment to keeping it real. Um not sure if this is a room for improvement, so much as a clarification. But we also hear "Oh, man, you should do... something!" From- from- from folks a lot. So A) of all, we love you, never change, keep in touch. But like Gene tells us, we can't know all the things. So we're gonna keep building on our own areas of expertise in designing the show. But, I think we can also keep pushing ourselves to find ways to include more perspectives, and more folks with different areas of expertise. And speaking of including more voices, hey Ilyse, what's on deck for season three?

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

More, more is on deck for season three... more topics, and new format, and new

Megan Goodwin:

MORE! chances to improve. We'll be pairing up topics in religion with more interviews with experts. We are also thinking of adding segments or even regular minisodes called "Office Hours" where we would answer your submitted questions, so let us know what you think about that. We're going to talk more about season three, uh, toward the end of the of the episode too, gang. So don't- I dunno, hold on to your butts for the second time? Readjust your grip, I guess.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Shift that weight!

Megan Goodwin:

We're totally bugging about what's coming up. But that's- that's enough self-assessment for now. Let's give the people what they want.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

What-ever! It's PRIMARY SOURCES.

Megan Goodwin:

Primary sources![singing] We are squarely in the holiday season in what is now the United States between Thanksgiving and Christmas. And we all know how much IRMF gets bent out of shape about the holiday season = Christian stuff that masquerades as American, so today's primary sources is a holiday special, y'all. Let's talk holidays.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

I guess that means I have to go first.

Megan Goodwin:

Mmhmm. Yeah, yeah.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Alright. Well, I feel like on the pod I launch my own personal war on Christmas,

Megan Goodwin:

So proud of you.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

I promise goyim that I want you to have a lovely holiday and meaningful times, reflect, recharge, and reconnect. I just also really hate Christmas season. It's so offensively clear that I'm not quite right this time of year. Someone just tried- like literally last week just tried to explain to me that Christmas lights, and even the word "peace" as house decorations are secular, and I was just like, girl. No, uh uh, no. Let me launch into a text message battle about the ways in which those are not secular.

Megan Goodwin:

Incorrect.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

No, those are like a de-dogmatizing your religion and pretending like I have equal access- Yeah, girl, no. Anyway, here's the deal, nerds. I told Goodwin that I would tell the story of when I ruined Christmas for a whole first grade class today as part of our holiday special.

Megan Goodwin:

I love you so much. So special. I love you so much. Go ahead, okay.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

So here goes. In Miss Tennebruso's first grade class, I jumped on a table, like, feet on the table, like, New Jersey trash, and screamed to the best of my

recollection:

"Santa isn't real, and your parents are liars." Because, Miss T, who I adored, I loved this woman. But she, perhaps unbeknownst to her was following on the kindergarten slight that I experienced in Mrs. Connors class, whom I also adored. When she came around, we had to make these, uh, like brown paper bags from the supermarket- we had to color a piece of paper to staple on to that, to fill with all the art crap we'd made for our parents for the holidays, right? And so the piece of paper that we had to color on our holiday bag both in kindergarten and in first grade, which is when I lost it, was a choice. And you could choose a Christmas tree or a Santa and I, the lone Jew on Christmas, could stand it no more. I, tiny seven-year-old me, broke in half.

Megan Goodwin:

Awh.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Like, I want you to imagine that a public school's like "a Christmas tree or Santa is okay because they're secular!" And for all you goy right now that are like "it is secular, there's no Jesus!" I'm like, You're joking. And also, since some of you are going to take offense at being called goy. No, I'm reclaiming my right to be snarky in my native tongue. What's amazing, um, about this- this moment of like screaming at the top of my lungs and needing to go sit on my alphabet letter, to like cool off, and eventually being given a blank piece of paper to draw on what I want, which- which I remember feeling just as bad, right like so now not only am I not able to choose what the other kids have, but like, I had to make my own? That's lame. I'm a first grader I don't know how to draw, I certainly don't how to draw as well as a pre-printed color page. And all of this just so you don't have to teach us the week before vacation. Anyway. I think what's amazing to me about this particular story is that now I have a second grader and she's really struggling with the holiday season and not like I was, she is not- let's say pugilistic in the way that I am in my soul, she's not doing a "I hate you and your parents are liars and I'm going out of my way to ruin this holiday for you" way that I absolutely own was my persona as a small person.

Megan Goodwin:

I love it so much.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

But- But our kiddo is essentially in a Christmas lights aren't for us, Christmas trees aren't for us, No I don't want to walk around the neighborhood looking at it. I- "Why can't I match red with green mama? Why does that upset you so much? No one knows about Hanukkah. I'm the only one who does the Jewish holidays in my class. How come I had to miss school for Rosh Hashana but," and then lists her friends names, "they don't miss school for Christmas." So like, that kid is way calmer than me. But I think she's feeling the same level of square peg, round hole, but this time of year makes non-Christians feel. And so...

Megan Goodwin:

I also loved her personal war on the Great British Bake Off.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Yeah no, that bitch was so mad about the violence that the Great British Bake Off did to babka and if you are not familiar with that violence, please go look it up. A lot of Jews then baked babka in resistance work, but she literally screamed at the TV"None of them care. They're not Jews!" and it was amazing. Anyway, I want folks to enjoy their holiday season but I think I also want them to use it as an adjective. It is the Christian holiday season. The Jewish holiday season is long over and BTW, we figured out how to do it distantly without as much whining. So, like, what would it feel like, goyim, to be an adjective, instead of the noun? Not THE holiday season with a descriptive marker, but A holiday season, no definitive clause here, just Christian-holiday season. Anyway, that's my personal war on Christmas, I stand by it but I will have Chinese food on December 25 as we do every year. Megan, you're up.

Megan Goodwin:

Awesome, just to stay in the spirit of the season I also hate Christmas.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Yeah, kill all the joy!! Kill it good!

Megan Goodwin:

I hate it so much... I hate it so much. I feel like the entire damn country stops even pretending that we're not a Christian supremacist state and worse they sing fucking songs about it! Terrible songs! And the songs are everywhere and you cannot escape them and they start in October now! It's okay- sorry the dog just ran in from the other room to check on me.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

You are frightening animals, take a deep breath.

Megan Goodwin:

Yeah, I am. And I need- As- as I am saying this, need you to see me as the f ll on Grinch with the drumstick smacking my temples complain ng about the noise, noise, noi e, noise! Because that's how I eel about it. And every season or every year, the season ge s longer. And every year someon tries to convince me that Chris mas isn't really about religio anymore. Hello, Have we met? And every year I try to figure out why I didn't just go have Ch nese food with Mofus i stead of succumbing to thi fucking victory lap of c pitalist Christian s

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

At least, if it gives you, um, any quarter this this time around, this year it's the COVID's fault. So-

Megan Goodwin:

It's true!

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

You can just blame the 'rona.

Megan Goodwin:

Well, also I'm in my house now so, nobody can make me accidentally listen to stupid"Christmas Shoes" or the"Dominic Christmas Donkey" or whatever that.... I'm safe. But I didn't- I didn't actually always hate Christmas. I was- I was a pretty dedicated Catholic for a long time. And once, a long, long time ago, I was a wee ginger child who sang in the church choir. Frankly, in retrospect is probably another reason I hate Christmas because I had to do so many masses. Yeah, like I was way into Santa also until I found his wrapping paper in my mom's closet. Which was a whole, like, moment of breaking for me because I realized that there was this vast conspiracy being orchestrated by my mother.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Yeah, you would've appreciated me when I was in first grade.

Megan Goodwin:

I would have- I would have not through high school probably, because you wouldn't talk to me because of the sports but yeah, kindergarten then again then grad school. Um, yeah, I was like, my mother, not parents, but my specific mother has been lying, I guess to everybody?

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

So you didn't think your mom was like enacting a conspiracy? You thought your mom was the progeniter of the conspiracy?

Megan Goodwin:

Yeah she WAS the conspiracy. Yeah.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

That's so great.

Megan Goodwin:

Yeah, no, and then well like I- I was gobsmacked. And I immediately went to tell my sister, not because I was, like, trying to ruin Christmas because, like, I had important information that she didn't have. And she needed to know.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Yeah, my- my step mom's an alien. This is like that level of, like, you have pulled back the mask.

Megan Goodwin:

Exactly, exactly. Like, I tried to red pill my sister, and- except the red pill here is about Santa and not men's rights, which are nothing. Um, and my sister started crying because she's like two and a half years younger than I am, and she was sad about no Santa. And my dad yelled at me for ruining Christmas. And I like- I vividly remember being seven years old, being like, Dad, you don't understand. Mom is Santa. MOM IS SANTA. Clearly he didn't know. So, right? So like, this is not so much a religious story, as it is a story about how we- and by we, I mean, I probably should have realized that I was on the spectrum much earlier than I did i.e. last year. Thanks #ActuallyAutistic Twitter and also Hannah Gadsby. I- There's not really takeaway lesson there. It's just last day of classes. And it turns out my mom's Santa, so, you need to know.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Well that was primary sources.

Megan Goodwin:

Primary sources[singing?]

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Alright, well, listen, before we head off to not enjoy the Christmas season. Also, if you're if you're- you know, part of the Mofu couch crew on Christmas to watch Elf, I can't help it, I love that movie, and tell our nerds. Let's- let's tell our nerds what's up for Season Three in a more, uh, direct way.

Megan Goodwin:

Yes, let's! Uh, talkin' bout format changes. Next season, we're going to let others teach us all things. Here's how it'll work. We are going to do an episode setting up the 101 on a topic or idea, then in the following episode, a baller scholar of religion and something we are not experts in, will come and do the next level chat with us about the topic. Think of it like we set up the intro, the scholar hits it out of the park, and we prepare you for a classroom visit. Each little mini arc is two episodes and we are in for some thematic treats.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

We have such a good lineup... Please can we tell everybody what it i

Megan Goodwin:

Yeah we do, we do.? Yes, we may go for it.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Can I do it in particular?

Megan Goodwin:

Yes, you may. You specifically on behalf of-

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

I'll do- how about I do half and you do half?

Megan Goodwin:

No you can- I mean you can do as much as you want I was gonna give it to you in the spirit of the season.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

No, take back your dirty Christmas gift, I don't want it. I'm kidding. I'm kidding everybody. I send out gifts. I'm really not a monster. Just like a wee monster. I'm like a 4'11" monster. Alright, let's focus.

Megan Goodwin:

You're my favorite monster. Focusing, alright! Who are we chatting with next semester, assuming that they still want to talk to us after we hated on Christmas?

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Yeah, that's true. We are probably making enemies left and right. But, in no particular order we are going to do- We're going to talk about public scholarship, children's literature and representation with Dr. Simran Jeet Singh and a two episode arc that we feature him in. Simran i a dear friend of ours, but mor importantly, he's basically world famous scholar o religion, Sikhi, and he's a fierce advocate for religious literacy. And his most recent book is actually the New York Public Library recommended kids book "Fauja Singh Keeps Going" which is a picture- uh, a pic ure book for elementary sc ool read

Megan Goodwin:

It's so great, and it's so beautiful. And hey, it is the holiday season and it's also available wherever books are sold. We're also talking Islam, jinn, and texts with Dr. Ali Olomi, who is a Twitter legend. His weekly Wednesday threads on medieval Islamic magic, astrology, and jinn routinely go via viral as well they should. We, basically, are stans of Ali Olomi and we invited him to talk about how and why thinking about the parts of Islam that you never learn about, like ghost stories, is important.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Yeah, we stan the master of, frankly, academic cited threads.

Megan Goodwin:

Yeah, yeah. It's- the- things of beauty and truly they brighten up every single Wednesday.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

They're great. In Season Three, we'll also talk Bible, magic, and religion with Dr. Shaily. Patel. Shaily is another badass scholar whose work centers on something lit- neither of us know anything about, which is namely early Christianity.

Megan Goodwin:

Okay, I did TA in that class, I don't know anything about it, but I was TA'ing for it. So-

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Well that's... a self-own? Or a testament to your amazing teaching, or the ways in which to have health insurance, we will work any job available to us as grad workers.

Megan Goodwin:

Can confirm.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Anyway, we're gonna have Shaily on to talk about how we know the difference between magic and religion, what's at stake in that difference? And why we moderns should care about all this ancient biblical history.

Megan Goodwin:

Yeah, and one of the things that I really appreciate about Shaily is the way that she can take this really specific, like, millennia-old way of approaching text and make it relevant to the way that we still think about text and Scripture. It's- she's great. So I'm very excited.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Yeah, no and we need a little bit of that. And nerds, I know a lot of you have been asking for things like texts, like Christianity, like Bible, and so Shaily is kindly going to help us out.

Megan Goodwin:

We really appreciate it because we can't know all the things. And last, but certainly, absolutely not least, the Dr. Anthea Butler will be chatting with us about US politics, white evangelicalism, and racism. She is the greatest of all time, and all things US religion. She is well known and an oft-cited scholar of race, religion, and what's now in the United States. And she's coming to school us(and we are so grateful) about all the stuff her forthcoming book is about. It's called"White Evangelical Racism." So you know we're stoked. Ahead of our season three format change, we'll post a syllabus. If you're curious about how to teach with a pod, hit us up on Twitter, each episode's show notes are a treasure trove of lesson-planning goodness, like I have to say this, because that sounds like we're patting ourselves on the back. And we should, because we did a lot of work. But also for real when I was planning my class last semester, I was like, Oh, right, I don't have to come up with something out of- out of nowhere in order to teach the pod. Ilyse already listed all the things that I can assign. And so many of them are short and accessible already. So like a first year undergrad can definitely read this quick op-ed and then talk about the pod. Thank you past us.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Yeah, and I'll- I'll add that one of the things that I am planning to do between seasons is to make like, little info, like, graphics about how you might assign things so not everything follows the pod exactly. Because everything we put in, there's a ton of stuff that gets to the cutting room floor, so if your class is about Buddhism, you'll notice, we don't often talk about Buddhism, but we often put in the show notes, other kinds of resources that you could use about that. So, hopefully they are accessible, but also useful. We are hoping to make this public scholarship process as effective as it can be. So go use it. It's there.

Megan Goodwin:

Yes. Awesome. Okay, HOMEWORK for this time:

Simpsons:

Homework? What homework?

Megan Goodwin:

Have fun, support your local businesses, try not to impose your religion on others, please and thank you.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Yeah, I guess, stay hydrated and socially distant and masked, maybe have some bubbly, or some other drink that you quite like to have. Stay tuned, we hope. And with that, peace out, nerds! See you next semester, and we hope not sporadically.

Megan Goodwin:

And do your homework! It's on the syllabus.

New Girl- "Santa":

I was five years old when Santa gave me my own firetruck and a teddy bear that smelled like my dad's cigarettes. I just believe things and go on believing them. Someone tells me a fat man's bringing me dolls every year, I just don't question it. You would have been my nightmare. We were on very strict instructions from Rabbi Shmuley not to say a word until the last Christian kid found out about Santa Claus ruining Christmas, very bad for our brand.

People on this episode

Head Shot

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst

Co-host
Head Shot

Megan Goodwin

Co-host