Keeping It 101: A Killjoy's Introduction to Religion Podcast

RINDWY: Why Write a Book?

• Profs. Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst and Megan Goodwin • Season 7 • Episode 704

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Because books is what we do, nerds! Tune in to hear us geek out about why we decided to pivot to v̶i̶d̶e̶o̶ text in our almost-here new title, Religion Is Not Done With You.

As always, be sure to visit keepingit101.com for full show notes, homework, transcripts, & more.

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Keeping It 101: A Killjoy's Introduction to Religion is proud to be part of the Amplify Podcast Network.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

This is Keeping it 101: a killjoys Introduction to religion podcast, which is part of the amplify podcast network. We are grateful to live, teach and record on the current ancestral and unceded lands of the Abenaki and Wabanaki peoples, as well as the lands of one federally recognized native nation, the Eastern Band of Cherokee Indians, and seven North Carolina state recognized tribal entities. Increasingly, though, native folks are pushing us to forgo land acknowledgements altogether and focus on action items. So let's obviously start with land back. And as always, you can find material ways to support indigenous communities on our website.

Megan Goodwin:

What is up, nerds? Hi, hello. I'm Megan Goodwin, a scholar of American religions, race, gender and politics.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Hi, hello. I'm Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst, a historian of religion, Islam, race and racialization and South Asia.

Megan Goodwin:

Hi, hello. Indeed. It is so nice to be back in action. And today, you know, after the requisite banter, obviously we need to do a banter. We've got an episode that's sort of getting at a question we get constantly from many of our dear nerds and our families, chosen or otherwise, our students, and frankly, like a lot of editorial boards,

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

ooh, I have a feeling I know where this is going.

Megan Goodwin:

You should you do our outlines? You wrote these words, the words that I am saying right now.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

If that were true, I might write some wild things like, um,

Megan Goodwin:

Purple Monkey, dishwasher, fart, hell damn ass.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

I win. I win this round.

Megan Goodwin:

You do a winner? Is you anyway? It was the blurst of times?!

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

You were saying, Where is this going? Where are we taking our nerds?

Megan Goodwin:

As you might have heard, dear listeners, we have a new book coming out with Beacon Press on November 5, 2024. It is called Religion is Not Done with You.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

And nothing else is happening on that day, like voting in the United States for either a felon or a black woman cop. Like no big deal. Nothing else is going on on november 5. ,

Megan Goodwin:

Yeah there was a lull! We saw a gap in the calendar, and thought, You know what? This is our moment. Yep.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Anyway, because of that lull, that deeply slow news cycle that we're anticipating in the future, because this book is coming out in this lull, we get a lot of asks about why we do what we do as podcasters, for sure, and we've talked about that on this podcast a few times, as well as several other podcasts, like on the Amplify Network Stream and on Engender and a few other places.

Megan Goodwin:

yep, but this is a specific question we get about why we decided to take a podcast and turn it into a book. Famously, you can listen to us for free. We are very affordable, I know, but a book, she costs money, if not for you, then for your local library. And Bt Dubs, we love it when you get our book at the local library. We also love it when you buy it, but, but Hooray for libraries, which is a weird political moment that that is a political statement, but like Hooray for libraries anyway, this episode is an answer for why we wrote this book as a book.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Yeah, this episode is one of a couple more episodes like this to be honest with you. One, we're gonna focus on how the writing happens. Another, we're focusing on how we figured out how to write together, because, dear nerds, being best friends and chosen sisters does not mean it does not mean that we know how to write in one voice. And finally, we have a very special mini so that we're dropping on the fifth of November, a day where nothing else is happening, where we read you our acknowledgements.

Megan Goodwin:

which, like I'm feeling really smooshy about that, to be honest, because we learned that the voice actor who's recording the audiobook of religion is not done with you--We have an audiobook. It's so exciting, I cannot--but they don't include the acknowledgements. That's not how nonfiction gets done, I guess. But we loved writing that part of our book, and we love thinking people, and we love the idea of those thanks being in our own voices,

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

and lucky for us, we have our very own audio platform ready to go, just ready

Megan Goodwin:

so feels coming at your face on november 5, but for now, IRMF let's get into it. Why did we write this book? Why turn a podcast, an audio medium, into a book, a visual medium?

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Well, I had not ever thought of a book as a visual medium, and that just threw me real hard. But, well, it is, though it's a visual I don't know it's a visual medium and a technology. Anyway, yeah, the reason. I really enjoy turning our podcast into a book is three reasons which will make our KathyFoody giggle because I am a woman who loves a list of three.

Megan Goodwin:

Three shall be the number of the list.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Three is the number number one, books. Books books is what we do. Like real talk Megan, we are scholars and academics, and so at a certain way we are trained, regardless of whether or not our specific location in the academy has shifted or exists or feels correct. We were trained to write books. We were trained to do research and then put that research out into the world, specifically in the form of books, peer reviewed books. So we write books, we think in books. Books are what we do. That's number one.

Megan Goodwin:

Can we I feel like there needs to be merch, like books are what we do, which would be fun again for a podcast. What do we do? Books!

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

all right, nerds, maybe we should put out like, um, we are doing some merch around the book. So maybe we should put out like a questionnaire, what merch would you like, famously, for a audio medium. Okay, the second thing-- books is what we do, beef it's what's for dinner. The second thing is, I think it's a question of audience, right? Like we have figured out who our podcast audience is and has been, and where we think we might grow in the future, or who we think our stalwarts are, but podcasts have their audiences, and books have their audiences, and, yeah, there's like, several Venn diagrams in there, but I think it's easier to get this book in the hands of like my aunts than it is to get the podcast in their ears in a consistent way.

Megan Goodwin:

Yeah

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

and that's also something that we've learned from my students. My students love passing on podcast episodes, but they're more likely to share a book than they are to be like, Yo, Ma, listen to this podcast. You have to listen to seven of them to get the hang of it. And it's like, well, that's that's a lot of out from your parents, dear, beautiful students.

Megan Goodwin:

So podcasts are hard to skim. Yeah,

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

they're hard to skim. And like, I really do feel as an elder millennial and you representing Gen X, I don't know that. I don't know that we enjoy the like, two times speed of it all. Like we're already fast. We sound like Crazy Chipmunks, like, it's just not, it's not great, but a book you can consume slowly or, like, in five minute intervals, which feels less choppy than a podcast. So thing number one, why we turn this pod into a book? Books is what we do. Number two is this question of audience. I think we want more people to be learning about religion than we currently reach. And the third is actually to do with that, that speed thing,

Megan Goodwin:

the chipmunk issue,

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

we talk, we talk really fast. And even though we provide our listeners with transcripts and have since day dot of, our podcast, our speaking voice in the book is fast, right? Like we write fast, we think fast. Our sentences kind of feel like we're speaking in that fast voice, but a reader has control over how fast they read. And so I do think that some of the things we've said on the podcast feel different, hit, different sound different in the voice in your head than listening to us kind of rapid fire with, you know, some choice F bombs and giggles. So I think, I think all of those things means that this idea we have for keeping it 101, which is related to, but not the same as what's going on in Religion Is Not Done With You--I think it just gives us more coverage of the arguments we're trying to make.

Megan Goodwin:

And at the same time, I do think we retain a little bit of our voice, our speaking voice in the podcast, slash, remember when the copy editor was like, What is this crazy list of descriptors? Why are there no commas? I'm like, no, no, it's supposed to sound that way. No, I did that on purpose.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Overwhelmed. You want them to hear our voice rushing them through as if they are cascading off a mountain, like you should be unsafe.

Megan Goodwin:

exactly be unsettled by this sentence and also by this concept, and also by religion, which is not done with you.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

Yeah, those commas are safety belts. And like, listen, we live on the edge here in religion is not done with you.

Megan Goodwin:

We were Traction Park, children, there are no safety belts,

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

not traction Park!

Megan Goodwin:

you heard me

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

a plus New Jersey reference. Okay, Goodwin. Why? So that's why I think we're turning this into a podcast. Why or the podcast into a book? Why did you do what we did?

Megan Goodwin:

Oh, I mean, the folks at Beacon were kind enough to ask us to write one so, like, I'm not gonna lie, most of the things I published throughout my career were because somebody nice asked me to write them. I have no competitive spirit whatsoever. I am not formally in the academy anymore, so I have nothing to prove. And also I just, I don't, generally don't just do stuff, but if somebody asks me to do a thing like, oh, oh, that sounds like fun. Sure, hey, why not? In this particular instance, the nice person who would eventually become our editor at Beacon Press, Amy Caldwell, asked us if we would like to write a book based on this earpod. And we said, Yes, please, and also thank you. Also like not to get gushy, but the press is one of the big draws for me. I was ambivalent about writing a podcast book in general, but writing one for the same press that published James Baldwin, Mary Daly, Kate Bornstein, way too many other amazing authors to list right now, I enthusiastically consent to that. Yes, yes, yes. I said yes. I will Yes. Other benefits to writing down our thoughts about religion instead of just speaking them into the ether, include, podcasts are famously an audio medium, as we've discussed books. Let you include stuff like maps that don't translate well into audio. So our book has maps. We're really excited about it.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

We're so excited about the maps.

Megan Goodwin:

Also, as we have discussed on the pod, my brain loves a new challenge, and writing a book together was a challenge, both new and fun, sounding more about that process on an episode to come. Plus, I personally had never done long form writing about scholarly things and accessible tones. So like 750 to 2000 words is one thing, but I was curious to see if I slash we could pull off or pull off that tone in a book length project, much like our scholarly killjoy Northstar Sara Ahmed, who does this continually and with great success. So it turns out, yeah, I think we, we did. We can. Proud of us. And then my third thing was the utility, to be honest? Having a book where we can show our work and cite our sources and walk readers through big concepts we have to zip through on the pod to keep every episode from being like three hours long.

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

I know no one likes a long Ford podcast, except for me, I find love a long form, but no one else does. Everyone else is like, you're listening to a three hour podcast. Like, of course, I am, of course, I want three hours of this.

Megan Goodwin:

I just

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

no one agrees. I'm wrong.

Megan Goodwin:

Well, you also have media consumption habits that are unlike the average bear, so that

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

you mean just constant 24 hours of noise all the time.

Megan Goodwin:

Not everybody has has it all the time, always. So Tune in next month to hear about how we selected the case studies you have the three hours because it's all of the hours anyway. It was nice not to have to rush and to show our sources and walk you through in a slower way. But we also wanted our work to be useful to as many people as possible. So like lots of folks who don't use podcasts to teach, do use books. Book clubs are a thing in a way, podcast clubs, at least to the best of my knowledge, or not, maybe they are, I don't know, like maybe I'm just not getting invited tomorrow, but so hopefully our we book baby will be of use in those spaces, in a way that our podcast toddler isn't, at least not yet, and that, nerds, is the story of how we came to write a book based on the pod. that illustrate the theories we're presenting in Religion is Not Done with You, which, as you'll no doubt recall, is forthcoming from Beacon Press this November. In the meantime, you can find us across social media, still on Twitter, reluctantly, and Insta Tiktok, Facebook, none of that curls your hair. We have a newsletter you can join via our website, which is keepingit101.com. Drop us a rating or review in your podcatcher of choice. If

Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst:

you want to invite us to your campus or your local bookstore, which is a thing that is happening with a very, very high rate recently. Please, please, please reach out to us, or reach out to Caitlin Meyer, who is our incredible marketing and publicity Maven over at Beacon. How you do that is over on our website, which, if you didn't just hear it, is keeping it one, oh, one.com, it.com's We'd love to come visit, but get in touch early and often. And with that, peace out nerds

Megan Goodwin:

and do your homework, it's on the syllabus.

Elv:

every day, every day, every day, every day, I write the booki.

People on this episode

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Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst

Co-host
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Megan Goodwin

Co-host